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00:00Now, back to Willard and Dibs.
00:03What was on the menu?
00:04Seven steaks?
00:05Two whole chickens?
00:06I went and got a giant Wagyu steak for him.
00:11So I'm ecstatic about that.
00:13On 95.7, the game.
00:16Wagyu steak, you say?
00:18Yeah, Wagyu steak.
00:19Wagyu steak?
00:20All right, hold that thought.
00:22I want everybody to think about a Wagyu steak.
00:25I have been all day.
00:26Just think about a Wagyu steak.
00:27I want you to hold that thought.
00:30And as we get ready to not just hear from the Hall of Fame offensive tackle Joe Thomas,
00:36but we get to see him as well because he's joining us on the tube.
00:40So get over to YouTube.com.
00:41You can see Joe.
00:43He joins us on the River Islands guest line.
00:46Thank you so much for coming on, Joe.
00:47How are you doing today?
00:49I'm doing great.
00:50I'm doing great.
00:51Just picked my daughter up from soccer and excited to be out with you guys.
00:54Look at that.
00:55He's a good dad.
00:56And also, I'm told, maybe knows a thing or two about putting together a great Wagyu steak.
01:03We talk about food on our show a lot.
01:05So, like, we'll get to the football.
01:07But Hall of Fame beef.com, an offensive lineman who's raising beef on a farm.
01:14Do tell.
01:15I'm intrigued.
01:15Well, I grew up in the suburbs.
01:19I drove by some farms as a kid in Wisconsin, but never actually thought I would own a farm.
01:24And then in 2012, I owned a farm, which was awesome.
01:27Like, yeah, it was pretty cool.
01:28I had my own little space.
01:29And then when I retired, my kid said, hey, Dad, you got nothing going on.
01:32Why don't you put some cattle out there?
01:34We'd love some pet cows.
01:36And I was like, okay, that sounds cool.
01:38These are some pets.
01:39It's okay.
01:39We can get away with eating these ones.
01:41So, let's really do this stuff right.
01:43Let's get some Wagyu out there.
01:45Let's get some premium Angus.
01:46And really, I dove into it.
01:48It became just a huge passion project for me.
01:50Now my kids are involved.
01:51They help me feed the cattle.
01:53They get in the skid loader with me.
01:55And it's just really been a lot of fun just diving into that whole world and kind of taking the passion from my football game and the detail that I put into that to try to put it into my cattle and the food that you raise and kind of the health journey that I went on after I retired, trying to lose weight and figure out, you know, what makes me feel good, what type of food maybe is not so good for me.
02:15It doesn't make me feel so good.
02:16And trying to raise as much of it as I possibly can on my farm.
02:19And then now transitioning to being able to offer to friends and family.
02:23And then now through our website, halloffamebeef.com.
02:26So, it's been a lot of fun.
02:27Big learning process.
02:28I'm still a rookie.
02:29But I think we're putting out some pretty awesome stuff right now.
02:32And you look great.
02:32And you don't look like an offensive lineman.
02:34Seriously.
02:35I just wonder, though, about the awkwardness of the kids where farm to table is one thing, but pet to table is another.
02:42Is that a tough transition for the kids?
02:45You know, we're not putting that on the label exactly.
02:48But, you know, the kids got over it pretty quick.
02:50I figured that they need to, like, understand right away.
02:53And so, you know, the very first steer that we had, we named him Jack, which is my son's name.
02:58And so, we had Jack Burgers and Jack Steaks early on.
03:01And he was a little sensitive, but we made sure to have it done when he was four.
03:05And he's nine now.
03:07And so, they got over it pretty quick because Jack was pretty tasty.
03:11Wow.
03:11Wow.
03:12That's amazing.
03:12By the way, speaking of that, Joe, you said, like, your health journey and Joe Thomas is joining us.
03:18And I know that this happens sometimes in football.
03:22I've joked before.
03:23The offensive linemen get smaller.
03:24The running backs get bigger.
03:26And you all meet in the middle after retirement.
03:28But, like, I used to work with Nick Hardwick.
03:31You may know him.
03:32He, like, I mean, unrecognizable, the idea that he was an offensive lineman.
03:37So, we're dudes here.
03:38And I feel like I can ask you this.
03:40How much do you weigh now, Joe?
03:42Yeah, thanks.
03:43That's something you can't get away with, with asking somebody in the office.
03:46The HR is going to be knocking on your door in a minute.
03:48But, no, I'm, like, 250 right now.
03:50Nick Hardwick, I haven't seen him in a while.
03:52But I saw him after he retired.
03:53I mean, he looked like a yoga instructor out there.
03:55Seriously.
03:56With all the weight he lost, he looked fantastic.
03:58He had to feel incredible as well.
04:00And, you know, that was a big motivation for me, like, just retiring because of a lot of injuries that just kind of built up.
04:07And the soreness and the swelling, the wear and tear.
04:09I mean, I was sliding down the stairs on my butt my last season in the NFL.
04:13I played half a year, tore my tricep tendon.
04:16But I only got to practice three times a whole year because I was so banged up.
04:19So, it was really a journey of health that kind of led me to losing the weight and led me to raising stuff on my own farm and the farm-to-table approach with the cattle.
04:26And then trying to educate other people, a lot of people in their life wanted to lose weight.
04:30And I kind of helped get them started.
04:33And then now it's all about, you know, understanding where your food comes from.
04:35And that's the great news is I know where my food comes from.
04:38It comes from my farm in Wisconsin and the Driftless Hill.
04:40So, I don't have to ask that question anymore.
04:42And I know why I'm feeling better and looking a little bit better, too.
04:45Love it.
04:45Love it.
04:46Absolutely fantastic.
04:47Fun stories.
04:48Now, let's get into some ball with you as well, Joe.
04:50And one thing that I know our fans, 49er fans, are thinking about a lot is, A, the 49er run game, which we'll get to.
05:00But Christian McCaffrey touches is always a conversation every single year.
05:06And I'd love your insight having been a blocker for a run game and whatnot.
05:11Like, how do you sort of navigate the idea of how much is too much?
05:16You've got a great player, you want to lean on him, but then what about the end of the year?
05:21He's leading the league in touches.
05:23Is it too much right now?
05:25Well, I think that's where the trust between the player and the coach is so important.
05:29When Kyle was my offensive coordinator in Cleveland, he was one of the best coaches that I've ever been around.
05:35Not only for his scheme and the way he motivated players, but just the trust that he built,
05:39that relationship that he built with players where he could talk to them and he could get an honest answer from them.
05:43And so with McCaffrey, just having that relationship I know is very strong and having that honesty of like,
05:48hey, you had 25 touches in this game.
05:50You had 28 touches.
05:51Like, how does your body feel?
05:52How do you feel from a freshness standpoint?
05:55The measurements that they get with the GPS monitor, seeing that explosiveness, that acceleration,
06:00which really will tell you a lot about his central nervous system.
06:03We talked about my health journey.
06:04I got really nerdy on like the biomechanical side and the human science side of stuff where,
06:11like, if you're measuring your reactivity and your ability to accelerate and you see it's the same
06:16or it's better than it was in training camp at the beginning of the year,
06:18you know his central nervous system is recovered and he's going to be able to handle all those touches.
06:23When all of a sudden that reactivity, that acceleration that he has,
06:27maybe not the top end speed as much as just how quickly can he get up to that speed?
06:30How quickly can he suddenly change direction?
06:32You see that dip.
06:34Now, from a sports science standpoint, you know that, all right,
06:36that central nervous system is taxed.
06:38We need to dial it back.
06:40We need to find a way to have him recover more maybe during the week.
06:43And then think about, okay, he's more susceptible to injury when the central nervous system is not recovered.
06:48So now maybe this is a game where even though we really need him,
06:51because obviously he's what we got on offense right now because of the injuries,
06:55you're going to have to dial it back and then try to spread the ball
06:57and then try to use him as a decoy as much as you possibly can,
07:00because the other team doesn't know you're not giving him the ball if you line him up in the flat
07:04or if you line him up in the backfield.
07:06So just being on the field, he can be effective even without actually getting the football.
07:10Yeah, that's a wonderful point about the decoy factor.
07:13And just hearing you talk about the biomechanics and the other advanced analytics,
07:16does this also apply to offensive linemen?
07:19Because by the naked eye and many fans who watch Trent Williams at 37,
07:23it seems like maybe he's not quite the player that he once was.
07:27How do you look at an offensive lineman and be able to gauge when they've kind of taken that step down?
07:34Well, first of all, nobody ever cares about our GPS numbers because nobody really cares how we feel.
07:39They're just going to say, hey, by the way, you're out there every play.
07:41Get used to it, buddy.
07:42I don't care if you've got two torn MCLs and a high ankle sprain in your shoulders out of socket.
07:47You got to play, bro.
07:48But I think you're just watching a guy and seeing, like, what's his mobility level?
07:52Because I think for me specifically, leaning into my own experience, like, I still felt like I could move as fast as I needed to.
07:59I was as strong probably as I ever was.
08:02But when you have the joint surfaces that are starting to lose cartilage and you're starting to have more swelling in your joints,
08:09you can't bend the way you want to.
08:11And so because you can't bend and get into your position with the technique that you're used to, right, now you have to try to make up for it.
08:18But it's impossible because you're not as efficient in those positions.
08:22You can't bend your ankles to get your heels in the ground to create that force.
08:26You're not as powerful getting out of your stance.
08:29And so it's all those little injuries that kind of add up that make you feel like you're getting older,
08:33even though your muscles and your brain is probably working just as well as it ever has.
08:37So I think it's a tough thing when you watch guys that are getting older that really, you know,
08:42they still want to be out there and they're giving everything they got.
08:45But, you know, we all get old.
08:46You know, father time is undefeated, unfortunately.
08:48But I still think that Trent's got a lot left in the tank.
08:51And I think, you know, it's one of those things where sometimes you come out of training camp and you're grinding away.
08:56And actually, you get better as the season wears on sometimes as an older player
08:59because you just know how to take care of your body so much better than the younger players.
09:03We're talking with Joe Thomas, the Hall of Fame offensive tackle.
09:06And check out halloffamebeef.com.
09:08And you're listening to 95.7 The Game, KGMZ FM and HD1 San Francisco on Odyssey Sports Station
09:15in the home of the Golden State Warriors and Valkyries, always live on the free Odyssey app,
09:18coming to you live from the Laughing Monk studios.
09:20Joe, that was interesting that you just had the compliment that you did for Kyle Shanahan
09:25and the time that you spent together in Cleveland.
09:28What do you remember most about him as a coach?
09:31Well, I always tell people he was the best coach in any sport that I've ever been around
09:36because he knew how to motivate players in a way that I think was intrinsically more motivating than any other style.
09:44You know, there's guys that like to be your buddy.
09:46It doesn't usually work.
09:48They like to be hard on you, which works a lot with younger players.
09:51And, you know, if they're always screaming and yelling at you, it works a little bit at times.
09:57But I think with Kyle is he would show you on film, first of all,
10:01that he knew what every single player on offense needed to do on that play.
10:05He could coach it all up.
10:06I've never been around an offensive coordinator that could coach O-line
10:08because most of them come from the passing game.
10:10They come from the quarterback room or the receiver room.
10:13But he could coach every position.
10:15And then he would show you on film with empirical data that, hey,
10:19I'm putting you in the best position to possibly succeed.
10:22We are giving you the answers to the test before you go out there and play.
10:27And then now it's up to you to just play at your best.
10:30And knowing that I already had an advantage schematically
10:33that my coach was putting me in the best position to succeed on every single play,
10:38like that's the most motivating thing for a professional athlete
10:41who's trying to feed his family, who's trying to go out there
10:43and either prove that he can be a great player or prove that he still is a great player.
10:47And he really builds that team mentality within the offense,
10:51at least when he was with me.
10:52And I'm sure he's doing the same thing now that he's the head coach.
10:55Just because he was able to motivate you to just show you exactly what you needed to do
10:59and that if you just do what he asks, you're going to be in a better position to go
11:03overcome whatever weakness that you may have
11:05because you have the advantage over your opponent.
11:08And what is it about the scheme?
11:10And, you know, Mark and I, neither one of us played in the NFL.
11:13I'm pretty sure Mark didn't.
11:14I know I didn't.
11:15But the run scheme, what is it about the Shanahan run game
11:19coming from his dad all the way through Kyle
11:21that sets them apart from other teams?
11:24So Kyle Packages plays together.
11:26Most offensive coordinators that I've been around,
11:29they kind of have like a run sheet on one side
11:31and then they got like a pass sheet on the other side.
11:34And it's like, all right, first down in 10.
11:36He'll call on the headset to the offensive line coach.
11:39Hey, what run do you like here?
11:40Okay, 96 power.
11:42Okay, great.
11:42Let's call it.
11:43Boom, that play doesn't work.
11:44He's like, all right, now we're passing the ball.
11:45Then he goes to his pass sheet.
11:46Now he's calling stuff, right?
11:48And so those things don't really match.
11:49The formations, the personnel, the way they look,
11:52the way they're blocked.
11:53They don't really marry each other
11:56and they don't really go hand in hand
11:57where Kyle's calling everything.
11:59He's not asking his offensive line coach
12:01what he likes in the run game.
12:02He's thinking, all right,
12:03I'm going to set him up with this first play.
12:05Let's just, for a basic example,
12:07we're going to run outside zone to the left.
12:08We're going to give him a formation where it's a wing.
12:11We're going to send the tight end back across the formation
12:13to block the backside defensive end.
12:16And then we're going to run outside zone, okay?
12:18Now, the next play,
12:19we're going to run what almost looks like the same formation.
12:22They're obviously probably not going to line up
12:23in exactly the same thing,
12:24but maybe they'll motion to an end formation
12:27that looks the same way.
12:28They'll even bring that Y all the way across
12:31like he's going to block that defensive end on the backside.
12:34The offensive line blocking on the front side
12:35looks exactly like the run for the first three to five steps.
12:39Linebackers, safeties in the second and third level.
12:41Now they think it looks exactly like a run
12:43because you know what?
12:44It looks and smells exactly like the play before,
12:46which was a run.
12:47And so now they're coming up
12:48and they're making their run fits
12:50and their eyes are in their position
12:52where it needs to be in the run game.
12:53And all of a sudden that backside tight end
12:55who has a slice block
12:56who's going to block the backside defensive end.
12:58Now he just slips past the backside defensive end.
13:01Now he's wide open and flat
13:02because everybody on defense
13:03sees the exact same picture that they just saw
13:05on first down when they ran a run play.
13:07And so he lays out the entire game plan
13:11so that plays mirror each other.
13:13They match and they make it so difficult.
13:15They put conflict on the defense
13:17and they find the weaknesses in the defense
13:19to be able to put individual defenders in conflict
13:21where that guy doesn't know if it's a run or a pass.
13:23So he doesn't know if he has to go
13:25and fill in the run game
13:26or he has to drop in a pass game.
13:28And then even if the guy figures it out,
13:30it's that split second where he's indecisive
13:32that gives you the spacing in the secondary
13:34and the spacing on the football field
13:36to be able to throw the football where you want to go.
13:38And so if they know the defender
13:39that they're trying to put in conflict
13:41and they know that that split second of indecision
13:43is going to create a little bit of space,
13:45a couple yards, maybe on the hash,
13:4620 yards down the field.
13:48Now they're going to put a route right there
13:49and understanding the coverage
13:51and making sure that they're going to get the coverage
13:52that they want based on the shift
13:54in the formation and the personnel grouping that they get
13:56so that they can tell the quarterback before he starts.
13:58This is why he's had so much success
13:59with quarterbacks that are not very heralded.
14:01It's like, hey, that guy knows exactly
14:03where to throw the ball
14:04almost before the play is called in the huddle
14:07because he hears it in his headset
14:08and Kyle's saying, hey, 20 yards down the field
14:11on the left hash,
14:12that's where the hole's going to be, right?
14:13And so as long as he's seeing everything pre-snap
14:15like he expects,
14:16he knows exactly where the ball's going to go.
14:17Maybe he looks off the safety to start,
14:19but he knows exactly where he's going to get back to.
14:21And so he really simplifies things for quarterbacks
14:23and for an entire offense
14:25because all these plays are packaged together
14:26and you know where the holes in the defense are.
14:28Oof, that's some good breakdown right there.
14:30Wow, that's some Hall of Fame breakdown.
14:31Joe Thomas is with us.
14:33Hey, Joe.
14:34Yeah, I bet.
14:36Okay, so after we all eat our turkey
14:38on Thanksgiving Thursday,
14:40three days later,
14:41the 49ers are going to be in Cleveland
14:43and you don't need to remind our fan base
14:45that weird stuff can happen there.
14:48P.J. Walker beat the 5-0 49ers
14:50just a couple of years ago
14:52and then there was last weekend
14:53with the whole thing against the Green Bay Packers
14:56who were swaggering into town.
14:58What is it, man?
14:59Why is that place such a difficult place to play?
15:06Well, it's a hostile environment.
15:07It's cold.
15:08The weather's often pretty crappy
15:10on the shores of Lake Erie.
15:11The stadium's right there off the lake,
15:13so you get a cold wind that blows off.
15:16A lot of times you're getting moisture.
15:17You're getting snow.
15:18You're getting rain late in the season.
15:20You're coming in a lot of times from a warmer climate
15:23and you're maybe overlooking the Cleveland Browns
15:27a little bit because the record's not so strong.
15:28And so you got all these factors that kind of play into it
15:32and I think sometimes it leads to a little bit
15:34of a sleepy performance.
15:36Maybe the preparation isn't quite as great
15:38as it should be going into the game
15:39because you think you're playing an inferior opponent.
15:41You're going to Cleveland instead of Miami,
15:43so the guys aren't quite as excited.
15:45They're more excited to go home
15:46than they are to play the game.
15:48And I think this year especially,
15:49you're going to see the Browns win a lot of games
15:51that they probably shouldn't
15:52just because they've got,
15:53one, the best defense in the NFL right now,
15:55and two, in my opinion,
15:57the greatest defensive player
15:58that's ever played football in Myles Garrett.
16:00I don't know if you saw against the Packers,
16:02but there was actually called plays
16:03where the Packers were blocking him
16:04with three people
16:05because they could not double team him
16:07and stop him from hitting their quarterback.
16:10Yeah.
16:11He is incredible
16:12and a total game wrecker
16:13and he did.
16:15He did on Sunday.
16:16Hey, Joe, you're awesome, man.
16:19Thanks for coming on.
16:20Congrats on everything that you're working on
16:22and we're happy to talk about it anytime.
16:25We love Wagyu steak.
16:28Hey, guys.
16:29Thanks for having me on.
16:30Eat more beef.
16:31Eat more beef.
16:32There it is.
16:33Joe Thomas, ladies and gentlemen.
16:35Thanks for having me on.
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